The Kurt Bestor Interview

SLUG: Are you or are you not the anti-Christ of music, trying to usher in the kingdom of the Devil, known better by his other names: Old Scratch, Prince of Darkness, John Tesh, Yanni?

KB: You caught me. I’ve found out.

SLUG: So that’s a yes then?

KB: Yeah sure. If it sells albums.

SLUG: You told me that you read SLUG every now and then to see what’s going on in the other world of music, but it bothers you because you’re always getting slammed and compared to the likes of the very evil John Tesh. Is this comparison unfair?

KB: I think it’s probably narrow-mind­ed. Kind of short-sighted. I’d be sur­prised if a lot of people who compare me to some of those folks even listen to music. I say that knowing what I know about music and knowing what it takes to write some of the music that I write. I know it’s got a little something deeper in there than say Tesh does. ‘Cause I slam Tesh too. And I do so because I feel like there is a lack of sincerity. I’m a fan of any kind of music that is sincere. I have a problem with people who are out there writing music trying to follow the next guy, who are saying, “What can we do to make money? Who’s big right now? We’ll sound like Phish. We’ll sound like this person or that person.” They end up just chasing and it ends up being an insincere effort.

SLUG: So when you’re writing music, what is it that you’re going after, if you’re not going after a certain style?

KB: If I were going after $bucks$ I would be writing a different style of music that’s for sure. I’m in a genre that’s not a big money making thing. At Christmas time people will say, “Now wait a minute. You’ve got six shows and twenty-dollar tickets. You must be making money.” We do OK., but my genre of music is really more about what turns me on. What I’m all about is, I feel there is an appropriate style of music that needs to address certain emotions. Some radio-friendly type stuff for me is more like ear candy. Which is ironic, ‘cause I think that some of your readers would listen to my music and say well, “If that’s ear candy, then Bestor’s music is “ear divinity” or “cotton candy.” But what I’m trying to do is capture certain feelings and emotions that I don’t feel you could get by turning on your typical top 40 stations and your readers would probably agree with me. AC stuff, top 40, even the stuff on the BREEZE. I have a hard time listening to that stuff.

SLUG: Don’t you get airtime on the BREEZE?

KB: Not much. I just did an interview with them today, but I don’t get a lot of play because my music, at least some of the later albums like Sketches, and Innovators, draw too much attention to themselves. They don’t just float along behind your business typing. It’s not air pudding. My music has counterpoint. It has some influences from other countries. It has classical influences. In fact, a guy came up to me just the other day and said, “I really like your album, but that one song, I can’t play it in my doctor’s office. ‘Cause everytime the song comes on people pay too much attention to it.”

SLUG: You’re very aware of some of the stereotypes that are placed on you. Are any of them justified and do you think that maybe because of these stereotypes you’re pigeonholed into playing on one side of the fence, where some people won’t even give you a chance Sort of like Gary Coleman as Arnold Drummin’?

KB: Sure. I think I am stereotyped. I think I earned that stereotype to some degree. It just depends on where you’re coming from. I know that there are certain people in the academic world that look at my music and say “Hey, you’re making money with your music. You’re a prostitute.” OK. I guess I am. Based on their rules I’m guilty. Other people might say, “You know, your music is just so sweet and there’s no dissonance” or “There’s no edge to it.” And so I’m guilty by their rules. But the rules that I live by I feel comfortable with. I know it’s impossible to please everybody. So I start by pleasing myself. And I don’t think John Tesh is going to read SLUG anytime soon, but I would say that John Tesh probably starts by pleasing other people first. At least that’s my impression when I listen to his music and when I watch his concerts on TV. I get the sense that someone like that is more concerned about pleasing other people. My first X-mas album, I went to a record company I was with at the time , and said, “I want to do a Christmas album.” This was when no one had really done an X-mas album. So it wasn’t known if that was successful or not. They said, “That’s a dumb idea. It’s a bad time of year. You’ll sell stuff in only a two or three week window of opportunity.

SLUG: That repeats itself every year.

KB: Well, you’re thinking like me. They were thinking “We only have that small of a window of opportunity, why don’t you do something that can sell all year long?” But I thought it was a great idea and once again I went with my own feelings. I thought “I like Christmas. I like the way it makes me feel. That’s where people seem to forget all their stereotypes and we all like the same sort of Christmas stuff.” And I wanted to capture that in music. That’s an example of going against what common sense everyone was telling me. I just went with my gut-stinct. I have not let a lot of grass grow under my feet. Sam Cardin and I did an album together called Innovators. That is an album that doesn’t follow any kind of rules.

SLUG: Tell the truth now. Isn’t Sam Cardin just a bastard to work with? You can tell the truth because nobody reads SLUG. Especially Sam Cardin.

KB: I know Sam reads it. Sam Cardin is proba­bly the only person that I’ve been able to work with like that. We have worked together since ’82. He’s great.

SLUG: Isn’t he kind of like the ball hog in the big game though?

KB: I wish I could give you some dirt, but no. He would probably think I was the ball hog to be real honest. I’ve always been more of a show­man in our partnership. And I’ve always been the one who has probably promoted myself. When you’re in a team, sometimes that’s a little tough. So I would imagine he would be more irritated with me than I would be with him. And right now, I’m probably known a little more in general public than he is. Although, he’s known in the industry. So whenever we would go out, people would want autographs from me and not from him. That’s a little irritating I think. But he doesn’t care about that kind of stuff.

SLUG: Your music seems really moody to me. Not in an angst sort of way whatsoever, but more like accents to something like a film. Setting a mood to something else that is happen­ing. Do you see it like that or are your songs meant to stand alone?

KB: Well, I like to believe the songs stand on their own, but the reason you feel that way is because the way I think about my songs is just that way. I write music for films for a living, so I tend to think things that way. I have a hard time just sitting down and writing notes, or writing sounds, unless those sounds represent some­thing. So even if I don’t have a visual image in mind, I have to create one. On all my albums is what you call programmatic music. It’s not absolute music, which is music that doesn’t try to say pictures. It’s programmatic, which is music that’s supposed to paint pictures. Whether they’re pictures that I want you to see or not. And that’s not an accident. I choose to live in that world because I have a hard time writing note after note after note. And I’m drawn to other kinds of music like that. I like classical music. I’m drawn to singer songwriters. Shawn Colvin-, Mark Cohn-type, because they paint pictures with their words. I like the Dave Matthews Band, Phish, The Red Hot Chili Peppers, I like…

SLUG: Pantera?

KB: Not quite. Not Helmet. or…

SLUG: Butthold Surfers?

KB: No. I actually like things that have something different. I enjoyed Nirvana because they had such a different sound. I like Red Hot Chili Peppers. I mean I definitely come from a different lifestyle than they do, and I usually wear a little bit more than a sock, but I appreciate the fact that I think they are sincere with their music. I’m not the hippest guy on the block, but my record collection does not represent the greatest top 40 stuff in the world.

SLUG: In all honesty, do you have any Yanni or John Tesh albums in your personal CD collection?

KB: I have absolutely none of those. In all honesty I have none.

SLUG: Does your wife?

KB: My wife and I share common tastes. In fact, I think people would be surprised that I have no New Age type music. I listen to world music. The actual African Pygmy sound. I don’t buy some guy with a synthesizer making sounds like that. I love the real thing. My record collection would consist of movie soundtracks, classical music from A to Z, funk from the 70s. I love Tower of Power. I love Confunksion, Parliament, all that kind of stuff.

SLUG: Did you go see George Clinton when he came recently?

KB: I would love that stuff. I didn’t enjoy watching them that much. It was a little distracting. I just enjoy funky bass lines. Anything that’s sincere. I don’t like pop country music much. And I’m not a big Tammy Wynette-style fan. I don’t like that real twangy, fingers against the chalkboard voice stuff.

SLUG: That’s really funny, because when I was interviewing her she said she hates you too.

KB: I never got into any of that glam rock stuff. Even today there are versions of what I would call glam rock. I think what’s happened with Marilyn Manson right now is the same thing that happened to glam rock. I watched his latest video on MTV the other day. He’s not as unique anymore. When he first came out he was kind of fresh. Now he’s trying to propagate this image he’s got and he’s redoing himself a little bit. Then everybody else starts dressing like him and the whole goth world is holding on to him and saying, “Listen we love this. This is great.” And he’s going to get bored with himself and probably end up shaving his hair and go on a Mormon mission or something.

SLUG: Rumor has it that he’s going to get some ribs removed. Did you hear that one?

KB: What? Ribs removed?

SLUG: Yeah, so he can [REDACT] more easily.

KB: Oh, I see.

SLUG: So he can be a little more limber with himself.

KB: I understand. In fact uh, boy that would be tough.

SLUG: Yeah, that would be one hell of a feat.

KB: I try to listen to all that stuff. I really do. When I listen to the early stuff by Marilyn Manson, I felt like he was trying to do some really musically interesting things. Lately, the couple of new things that I’ve heard, I don’t sense that same kind of freshness. And he’ll try to outdo himself. Pretty soon when everyone starts to look like him, then he’s got to out do himself. It’s kind of like the Madonna thing.

SLUG: More marketing than music.

KB: So he removes ribs and he can do it himself. Then what do you do after that?

SLUG: That’s a hard one to top all right.

KB: Well it is. For me that’s kind of a dead end road. It gets away from the music. Now I don’t share that kind of lifestyle. I’m from Utah valley for heaven’s sake. I can sit back and say, “I’m never going to do that. But if he’s sincere about it and he’s really trying to say something from the heart, I’ll respect his right to do that.” But then when he starts manipulating the media and playing those games, he’s no better than John Tesh.

SLUG: What would be·the one thing that would surprise everyone about Kurt Bestor? Besides the indecent exposure charges?

KB: Those are pretty well public by now. Um, I think the stereotype of what I am is based on what people think my music is. I think people would be surprised that I know a lot about a lot of things. That I’m not just stuck in one New Age zone. It would surprise people to find out that I don’t have any of that kind of music in my library.

SLUG: It surprised me.

KB: In record stores, record people have a hard time sticking me places. I go in the New Age cate­gory because that’s just where you put it. I’ve got music on my albums that sound like it should go in the soundtrack area. I’ve got other music that’s like classical. There’s a song on the Sketches album that’s basically a classical piece that classical radio stations are playing. Those people hate the New Age just as much as other people. So, I think people will be surprised that I’m not just a one-trick pony. But that’s hard for me to put that out there because the records are out in front of me

SLUG: Barry Manilow syndrome.

KB: I actually know him. I was doing a Las Vegas show for Mary Hart of Entertainment Tonight.

SLUG: That’s when you met John Tesh too.

KB: That’s exactly when I met John Tesh. But I had to do an arrangement of “Smokin” by Boston, for Mary Hart to sing. And played by horns.

SLUG: Did she choose that?

KB: Well, I didn’t choose it. I didn’t want to take a song that I grew up on and give it to Mary Hart. She’s a sweet lady, but she sounds like Julie Andrews when she sings. It wasn’t very good.

SLUG: Just keep on talking.

KB: That’s right. I don’t even know if she changed the words or not. It was really funny. She got slammed and criticized. But uh, now where was I going with this. You got me off the track. Sometimes my fans say, “How come you did that album? It’s totally different from what we expected. It’s because I can’t repeat myself over and over again. I did a classical piece for the Utah Symphony and the Utah Symphony Choir with Terry Tempest Williams.

SLUG: Yeah, the girl that played that kid on The Cosby Show.

KB: Nice try. She’s an award-winning environ­mental writer. She’s from Utah, but she’s world-renowned. She and I did something together about Mt. Timpanogos. I’m going to put it on a CD and my fans are going to expect the same thing they heard last time, and it will be totally different. Luckily I’ve got listeners that are willing to follow me on the journey I take.

SLUG: Speaking of your fans, the last time we talked you mentioned that you wished that the crowds you attract for your live shows would loosen up a little and maybe form a mosh pit. I know they’re the most conservative people on the planet. Has anything out of the ordi­nary happened while you were playing live? Have any women ever thrown panties or bras at you on stage?

KB: No. In Utah County I don’t think they have those anyway.

SLUG: But you’ve done a national tour haven’t you?

KB: I have. I did a western swing last year in Dallas and Phoenix. No matter where I am, it has nothing to do with religion, I still attract that same kind of crowd. My demographic, according to my people, is 25- to 50-year-old women with, like, four kids and a welder hus­band. And usually the women drag the men to the concerts. I do think I get people to loosen up more than they typically do. It’s a far cry from anything you would see at a rave club or something, but people are starting to loosen up a little bit. I’m pretty casual at my concerts. I’m not stuffy.

SLUG: At least the cops aren’t hassling people in the parking lot for doing acid or selling grilled cheese sandwiches.

KB: I think they might have to set up a metal detector this year for the first time.

SLUG: You have to admit that a large portion of your audience, like it or not, are the same people that support the censorship of the Auguste Rodin exhibit at BYU. What are your thoughts on that whole thing?

KB: Certainly the people that come to my concerts are more apt to follow along than maybe people who read SLUG. We’ll make those kinds of stereotypes. But I think that whole Rodin thing’s a shame to be honest. Egads, I’ve been to Europe. There’s a difference between titillation and art. Madonna can come out with her sex book and she can call it art, but I don’t call it art. I don’t think that anything should be censored, but I think there should be appropriate places for people to see things. They should have a choice of going to see it. That’s what I believe. I think Mapplethorpe has his place, and I think people should be able to go see it. I don’t want to take away my choice. Because I think religious people, and I use that word in the broadest sense, should be more accepting. I think it’s a shame that people made that decision, but BYU is a private institution. They can do what they want.

SLUG: Do you think they censored it because of what they saw as perverse, or do you think they censored Rodin for reasons of violence, like when he’s fighting Godzilla?

KB: I don’t think either one. I think they censored it because they knew that they’ve got a lot of people who are narrow-minded in art, and aren’t able to handle stuff like that and I think that’s the biggest shame of all.

SLUG: Isn’t it their choice though, to handle it or not? They can always stay home.

KB: That’s right, but they’re smart. They are down in Utah County. They say “We want to get the most people, in Utah County primarily, to come and see this thing. We want school children to come. We want everybody to come. That’s our audience. So what are we going to play for our audience? We choose this stuff, and this stuff we choose not to.” They’re just considering their audience.

SLUG: So basically they’re being the John Tesh of museums.

KB: See, I think that whole freedom thing gets a little screwed up sometimes.

SLUG: Some people have too much freedom.

KB: Nobody has too much freedom, but when you live in a world, and no matter who you are in the music business, you have a listenership. You’ve got to consider who your listeners are going to be. There are certain things that I’m not going to do. I’m going to censor myself, like BYU. There are certain things I’m not going to do in concert. I’m not going to come out like Marilyn Manson at my concerts because I know who my listenership is. So that analogy with BYU is, they know they’ve got some narrow-minded people who live down there who can’t see a penis without thinking bad thoughts. That’s unbelievable. I mean, I’ve seen David, and you’re not only seeing a penis, you’re seeing a two-foot penis because he’s huge.

SLUG: That is kind of scary.

KB: We’re not talking, what’s his name, that new movie that’s out. Boogie Nights. I see David and I’m moved by it. Michelangelo did an unbelievable job portraying the human body. I think that’s marvelous. I don’t think that the people at BYU think Rodin is pornographic at all. I just think they know that little ‘ol ma and pa from Spanish Fork are going to come in and they are going to be highly offended.

SLUG: You call Happy Valley your home. The same place that made it so no swimming was allowed on Sunday, so that people who aren’t Mormon and don’t live on the col­lege campus still have to abide by BYU’s rules or lose their homes, etc… Do you feel that there is a separation of church and state when it comes to Provo?

KB: There are places where there are, and there are places where there aren’t. I don’t have a problem with the second example you gave, only because when a person got into that particular housing, they knew that that was the case.

SLUG: But when that’s the case throughout the city, and you have to have a job and a place to work…

KB: It’s not one hundred percent the case. I mean, If we wanted to speak specifically, there are places to drink there. There are places to have your fun.

SLUG: Have you ever visited the strip joint they want to shut down? Your  wife doesn’t read SLUG.

KB: No I have not. I drove by it. I’ve never been there. I choose not to go there.

SLUG: After you got out of drug rehab, you lost touch with your old friends and dealers. Do you ever miss them or that lifestyle?

KB: They can come to my concerts. I’ve got free tickets for all my former dealers.

SLUG: Because you owe them or because you want them there?

KB: I feel like I owe them. I’ll put this right out on the table. Anybody that I’ve ever bought drugs from will not only get free tickets for life, I’ll buy them a new car and I’ll pay their mort­gage payments for life.

SLUG: There have been accusations that on Sketches, my favorite of the three CDs you gave me, song number 10 has satanic backmask­ing on it. I tried to turn the CD backwards to see if I could hear it and only burned my hand with the laser. So clear this up for us. Is there any satanic backmasking on any of your albums?

KB: Natas! Natas! No. I have subtle messages in that one though. Seriously. I know this isn’t the answer you were looking for, but that partic­ular song, I take one melody and I use that melody, one little phrase. I try to turn it upside down. I play it all different ways. We tried to count how many times I use that quote in the song and there are over 60.

SLUG: More than 60? Say maybe, 666?

KB: You got me. Bestor is Satan. What a revela­tion. You heard it here first. Private Eye Weekly, eat your heart out.

—Ray M.

Read more interviews from the archives:
Descendents
God Street Wine

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